What if I told you that every time you market on pain points, you’re actually preventing people from making a decision?
That’s exactly what Alex Vonderhaar told me on the latest episode of the Marketing Minds Podcast – and honestly, it stopped me in my tracks.
Alex is the Founder & CEO of Hidden Falls Media, the last remaining independent Neuromarketing Agency in the world (most of the others have been bought up & tucked away inside companies like the NFL, IBM, Amazon & Apple) and the author of The Unconscious Buying Formula.
I first saw him break some of this down at a marketing event in Nashville & I knew I had to get him on the podcast to go deeper. What came out of it is one of the most eye-opening conversations I’ve had about why people actually buy.
As a Reminder, Our Goal with this Newsletter is to Give You the Highest Level of Value Possible. That’s my Promise to you & I intend to Over-Deliver!
Here’s a Sneak Peek at What’s Inside This Email:
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Why “Belief” is the Ultimate Conversion Metric (& why it beats marketing on pain points, price & features)
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The Big Shift from the Attention Economy to the “Nervous System War”
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The Pre-Sale Fix that can Raise Close Rates for Coaches & Consultants
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The “Hospitality Test” & the Back Side of the Funnel almost everyone forgets
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How Alex’s Team Built an AI Executive Coach for Every Employee (without ever putting AI in front of customers)
Alright, let’s Dive In…
Watch the Full Video on YouTube:
Belief Is the Ultimate Conversion Metric
Most agencies & marketers are laser-focused on the hard metrics. Click-through rate, add to cart, conversion rate… optimize, optimize, optimize.
And don’t get me wrong, I love a good metric as much as anyone (I’m a numbers nerd, haha)
But as Alex put it, we get so lost in the data that we forget every single number on that dashboard is an actual person – with psychological levers that got pulled to bring them into your business.
That’s where his #1 principle comes in:
Belief is the Ultimate Conversion Metric.
Not just belief in yourself. It’s getting your audience to feel that you’re on the same path as them. That you get who they are today – and who they’re becoming.
Here’s the way Alex framed it that really stuck with me:
Nobody buys a product because it has an extra 1.1 gigabytes. They buy what they believe it’s going to do for them in their life. They buy based on who they see themselves as today, or who they see themselves becoming.
Meanwhile, most businesses are marketing on Mechanisms, Price & Pain Points. Poke the pain, agitate it to no end, then present the solution.
The problem? Alex says the research points the other way – that approach can actually make it harder for people to decide.
When you align with someone’s identity instead, something powerful happens – your marketing starts to sort & segment people for you. The right people lean in. The wrong people self-select out. And layer by layer, you filter out the competition.
Plus, once your product is part of someone’s identity, upsells & repeat purchases get easier, and your customer acquisition cost gets spread across every future purchase they make.
This one hit home for me, because it’s the same principle behind the Hook in our YouTube Value-Ad framework. A great hook doesn’t just grab your ideal client’s attention – it also deters the people who aren’t a fit. Alex just gave me a whole new layer of science for why that works!
Quick Action Step: Pull up your current ads, VSL or sales page & ask yourself…
“Does this speak to who my ideal client is becoming, or am I just poking at their pain?”
From the Attention Economy to the “Nervous System War”
For years, we’ve heard that attention is the scarcest resource there is.
Alex believes we’re moving into something different – what he calls the “Nervous System War.”
The brands that win won’t just be the ones that grab attention. They’ll be the ones that can best regulate their customers’ nervous system:
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Who can make them feel Safe?
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Who can make them feel Heard?
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Who can make them feel like the brand is aligned with where their life is going?
His example: First Form & Andy Frisella.
Andy didn’t set out to build the world’s best fitness brand. He set out to build the world’s best people. Everything else (the podcast, 75 Hard, the content, the products) flows from that mission. The content shifts people’s identity day by day & the products become part of who they’re becoming.
That’s identity-based marketing at its finest – and it’s why those customers stay loyal, buy again & tell their friends.
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The Pre-Sale Fix for Coaches & Consultants
Since many of you reading this run Coaching, Consulting or Expert businesses, I asked Alex how to apply this to a typical “Book a Call” funnel.
His answer focused on the window between when someone submits the form & when they show up on the sales call.
Here’s where most of us go wrong:
Mistake #1: Fire-Hose Dumping Information
We assume people know everything we offer, so we bury them in emails, videos & info. But the brain can only process so much at once (Alex pointed out it’s part of why phone numbers are 7 digits long, not 14!)
Instead, your pre-sale sequence should help people confirm whether they’re in the right place.
Mistake #2: Trying to Close in the Speed-to-Lead Window
You’ve probably heard that you need to reach out to a new lead within a couple of minutes. Alex agrees – but the goal of that window is to make contact, not to close the deal.
Instead, let people sit in a little bit of healthy tension & let your marketing do what it does best: sort & segment.
He used a great analogy: a good therapist doesn’t sit down & tell you what your problem is in the first two minutes. They guide you so you have the “aha moment” yourself – because insights are far more powerful when they come from you than when someone tells you.
When you get this right:
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Your Close Rates go up (& your sales team is a lot happier)
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People who aren’t a fit get routed to a better-fit offer – or sent back into the marketplace with goodwill
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You stop hearing “we’ve got nothing but bad leads”
That last one was a big reframe for me. As Alex put it, you probably don’t have all bad leads – they just might not be right for the specific thing you’re trying to force them into.
(This pairs really well with the Green / Yellow / Red Application Grading System I’ve shared before – sorting leads by fit is one of the most underrated levers in a high-ticket business!)
Quick Action Step: Look at the first 3-5 touchpoints after someone opts in. Is each one helping them confirm “this is for me” – or is it just more information?
The Hospitality Test: Would You Let Them Into Your Home?
This one didn’t even make it into Alex’s book – so it was a fun bonus to dig into on the podcast!
Alex believes most businesses aren’t very good at hospitality – and it’s a huge factor in whether people trust you.
His exercise:
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Map out every single touchpoint someone has with your business – from the first time they hear about you, to the end of your program & beyond (it doesn’t have to be a straight line, for a lot of businesses it’s more of a circle)
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For each touchpoint, decide what you want them to be experiencing at that moment
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Find the friction & smooth it out
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Add moments of Surprise & Delight so it doesn’t feel transactional
Why does this matter? Because the brain loves predictability. It’s constantly asking “does this fit what I’m looking for?”
He shared two great Apple examples:
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Alex shared that when Steve Jobs was designing the iPhone box, his team studied how people reacted to opening different boxes & learned that the slow “drag” of the lid matters – it impacts perceived value
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In an Apple Store, the front tables run vertically into the store instead of horizontally across your path, so they never feel like a barrier – they draw you in
Then he said something I absolutely love: Trust is a vibe.
Two people can say the exact same words & follow the exact same process – and one builds trust while the other doesn’t.
And the biggest mistake he sees in the coaching & consulting world? We sterilize our personality out of our funnels.
If you’ve been reading this newsletter for a while, you know this is something I’m passionate about – showing up as the Authentic Authority. Your personality isn’t something to hide. It’s one of your biggest trust-builders!
(Side note: I just started reading Unreasonable Hospitality by Will Guidara & this conversation was the perfect companion to it!)
The Back Side of the Funnel (Alex’s Golden Nugget)
We all know the front side of the funnel: Top, Middle & Bottom.
But Alex says there’s a Back Side most businesses completely ignore:
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The Honeymoon Phase – they just bought, they’re excited, you’re excited
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The “What Have You Done for Me Recently?” Phase – the excitement fades (this happens to all of us, with every business we buy from)
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The Death Zone – they drift away
Most businesses deliver the transformation & then… nothing.
Great marketers catch people in that second phase, remind them how amazing the experience was & move them back into the middle or bottom of the funnel.
One of the best ways to do that, especially if you’re a digital-heavy business? Go Physical.
Alex pointed to Alex Hormozi’s last book launch. He did his normal digital promotion, but then added direct mail to people who had bought his earlier book. Nobody expected a physical piece from such a digital brand – which is exactly why it stood out.
Alex’s team does this a lot for online brands, with things like:
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A custom box with a pen, a pencil & a note from the team
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A water bottle branded with their logo, not yours
Small touches, big surprise & delight.
And not everyone needs to be pulled back in – some people are simply on a different trajectory now. That’s okay. The goal is to leave them better than you found them.
I’ll be honest, this one gave me a lot of food for thought. We put a lot of energy into our client experience, but our post-client experience is something I’m now looking at with fresh eyes.
Quick Action Step: What’s one physical or unexpected touchpoint you could add for clients who recently wrapped up working with you?
Should AI Be Customer-Facing? (How Alex Built “Ultron”)
You know I love AI, so I had to ask Alex where it fits into all of this.
His answer surprised me: His team uses AI every single day – but it’s never customer-facing. When they looked at their core values, it just didn’t fit.
He also issued a bit of a challenge. A lot of people believe ChatGPT is making them better, but ask yourself honestly:
Am I smarter, wealthier or faster at my job because of it?
When you peel back the layers, a lot of people realize AI has mostly been their “yes-man.” Alex’s view is that AI will amplify the operators who already have real skills – & leave behind the people using it to cover up a lack of skill.
(I compared it to a K-shaped economy – one group uses AI to amplify their gifts & pulls ahead, the other hands everything over & actually gets worse.)
So how does Alex use AI? Internally, with a system his team calls “Ultron.”
It started when a team member admitted she was spending 40 hours a month pulling data analytics for clients – and she’d been afraid to say anything because she thought AI would replace her.
Alex told her that wasn’t the conversation at all. The real question was how to get her back to doing what she does best.
From there, Ultron evolved into:
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A Single Dashboard showing every client’s health & performance (replacing a tool that was costing them around $800/month)
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A CRM Integration to tighten up their entire sales process
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An AI Executive Coach for Every Team Member – built on 5,000+ of their end-of-day reports & connected to their project management board
Each team member gets a daily brief on their most important tasks plus coaching on their personal goals – and the insights roll up weekly to department leads so leadership knows where people need support.
The goal isn’t to replace people. It’s to help every team member leave better than they came.
That’s the kind of AI use I love – human-first, with AI doing the heavy lifting behind the scenes!
From a Heart Attack at 21 to the Last Neuromarketing Agency Standing..
Alex’s story is honestly one of the most powerful I’ve heard on the podcast.
He was studying Neuroscience & Psychopharmacology at Ohio State with plans to become a neurosurgeon. Then, at 21, he had a heart attack he was lucky to survive.
His path changed, and he ended up working at a floatation therapy center that had just 60-90 days of runway before shutting down. The owner told him he’d need to learn sales & marketing.
So he put every penny he’d saved into a marketing course (fun fact: it was Traffic & Funnels, the same program I was in back then!) – and within about 18 months, they went from $200K in debt to $2.2M in annual recurring revenue.
All while he was making $8.25 an hour & living in his mom’s basement.
He then did door-to-door sales to save up about $50K, & on January 1st, 2018, he launched Hidden Falls Media.
It’s a perfect reminder that sometimes our hardest moments turn out to be a blessing in disguise – and lead us to the work we were meant to do.
Watch the Full Episode on YouTube:
There’s a LOT more in the full conversation that I couldn’t fit into this email – including more on the Unconscious Buying Formula, “Emotional Compression” in copywriting & how NLP fits into all of this.
Watch the Full Episode with Alex Vonderhaar on YouTube!
If you get value from it, drop a like & a comment on the video – it helps more Entrepreneurs find the show! 😁
Watch The Full Video on YouTube:
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Your Marketing Is Talking to People – Not Metrics
If there’s one thing I want you to take away from this email, it’s this:
Every click, every lead & every sale is a real person – with beliefs, an identity & a nervous system. When you market to who they’re becoming, make them feel safe & treat every touchpoint like you’re welcoming them into your home, the metrics start to take care of themselves.
Stay Tuned for More Great Value & Content Coming your Way!
I’m serious when I say I want this to be The Most Valuable Newsletter You’re Subscribed to!
I’ll see you in the next one!
To Your Success,
– Aleric Heck | Founder & CEO of AdOutreach
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